Am I being cheated?

If you will, picture this scenario.

An item is put up on eBay with an opening price of £1 and a hidden
reserve price. I put in a proxy bid of £50 maximum.

Two other bidders join the auction and I am outbid when the top bid
reaches £55.

Both the 2 other bidders retract their bids and I am informed that I
am the top bidder at £50 and that the reserve price has been met.

IF the reserve price was set at £50, the above is all in order.
However, let us suppose the reserve price was only £25. Or what if
there had been no reserve price set.

Surely the retraction of the two other bidders' bids should invalidate
my bids over and above the opening bid or reserve price, unless and
until a third bidder enters the market. In other words, failing
further bidders, I should be top bidder at £25 (reserve price) or £1
(opening bid.)

I am in correspondence with eBay regarding this and have yet to have
their final reply. I should be interested to hear what others think.

Mrs Nemo wrote:
> If you will, picture this scenario.
>
> An item is put up on eBay with an opening price of £1 and a hidden
> reserve price. I put in a proxy bid of £50 maximum.
>
> Two other bidders join the auction and I am outbid when the top bid
> reaches £55.
>
> Both the 2 other bidders retract their bids and I am informed that I
> am the top bidder at £50 and that the reserve price has been met.
>
> IF the reserve price was set at £50, the above is all in order.
> However, let us suppose the reserve price was only £25. Or what if
> there had been no reserve price set.
>
> Surely the retraction of the two other bidders' bids should invalidate
> my bids over and above the opening bid or reserve price, unless and
> until a third bidder enters the market. In other words, failing
> further bidders, I should be top bidder at £25 (reserve price) or £1
> (opening bid.)
>
> I am in correspondence with eBay regarding this and have yet to have
> their final reply. I should be interested to hear what others think.


I agree with you, the price should go back to what it would have been if the
people who retracted hadnt bid. When you placed the original bid you would
have been told if your bid amt didnt meet the reserve surely ?

S. Althaf

On 26 Jul 2003 04:37:15 -0700, mrsnemo@hotmail.com (Mrs Nemo)
scribbled:

>If you will, picture this scenario.
>
>An item is put up on eBay with an opening price of £1 and a hidden
>reserve price. I put in a proxy bid of £50 maximum.
Did you get a "reserve met" situation at that point? And what was the
current price at that point?

>
>Two other bidders join the auction and I am outbid when the top bid
>reaches £55.
>
>Both the 2 other bidders retract their bids and I am informed that I
>am the top bidder at £50 and that the reserve price has been met.
Informed by ebay or by the seller? What does it say in the
auction-description? Your final price is mentioned in the
auction-description. Does that say 50 pounds?

>
>IF the reserve price was set at £50, the above is all in order.
>However, let us suppose the reserve price was only £25. Or what if
>there had been no reserve price set.
>
>Surely the retraction of the two other bidders' bids should invalidate
>my bids over and above the opening bid or reserve price, unless and
>until a third bidder enters the market. In other words, failing
>further bidders, I should be top bidder at £25 (reserve price) or £1
>(opening bid.)
Yes, that's correct.

>I am in correspondence with eBay regarding this and have yet to have
>their final reply. I should be interested to hear what others think.
You have to pay what is mentioned as the final price in the auction
description. That final price is determined by ebay based upon the
sellers reserve and the bids made. Are you saying that you think ebay
made a mistake in determining the final price?

Nell

"Mrs Nemo" <mrsnemo@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:d0cc035e.0307260337.62264386@posting.google.c om...
> If you will, picture this scenario.
>
> An item is put up on eBay with an opening price of £1 and a hidden
> reserve price. I put in a proxy bid of £50 maximum.
>
> Two other bidders join the auction and I am outbid when the top bid
> reaches £55.
>
> Both the 2 other bidders retract their bids and I am informed that I
> am the top bidder at £50 and that the reserve price has been met.
>
> IF the reserve price was set at £50, the above is all in order.
> However, let us suppose the reserve price was only £25. Or what if
> there had been no reserve price set.
>
> Surely the retraction of the two other bidders' bids should invalidate
> my bids over and above the opening bid or reserve price, unless and
> until a third bidder enters the market. In other words, failing
> further bidders, I should be top bidder at £25 (reserve price) or £1
> (opening bid.)
>
> I am in correspondence with eBay regarding this and have yet to have
> their final reply. I should be interested to hear what others think.

Seems dodgy but from what you have said the reserve price was definitely
£50.

--
Best Regards
Niel Humphreys
Snowdon Computers

"Snowdon Computers" <sales@snowdoncomputers.co.uk> wrote in message
news:bfu2kc$2kb$1@newsg3.svr.pol.co.uk...
> "Ali Hopkins" <fn62@dial.pipex.com> wrote in message
> news:bfttm5$imc7l$1@ID-97728.news.uni-berlin.de...
> >
> > "Snowdon Computers" <sales@snowdoncomputers.co.uk> wrote in message
> > news:bftt7g$ulj$1@newsg3.svr.pol.co.uk...
> >
> > > Seems dodgy but from what you have said the reserve price was
definitely
> > > £50.
> > >
> >
> > If it was £50, wouldn't he have been told? You know, the "you are the
high
> > bidder and the reserve has been met" bit?
>
>
> I will try and explain this, hope it makes sense.
>
> e.g. an auction starts at £1 with a reserve of £50
>
> If someone proxy-bids under the reserve their bid will be treated like any
> other bid in that it will beat the current bid if possible, or increase
the
> other proxy so it is not beaten.
>
> If someone proxies a bid higher than the reserve, say £70, the bid will
then
> increase to sit at the level of the reserve regardless of ay smaller proxy
> bids.
>
> That the OPs bit immediately shot up to £50 and did not stay at £1 tells
me
> that the reserve was £50.
>

Oh, I'd agree with that - but the implication was that Thingy (sorry, brain
is weekended!) did not know what the reserve was, and that didn't make
sense. If he'd proxied higher than the reserve, he'd have been told, hm?

Ali

> You have to pay what is mentioned as the final price in the auction
> description. That final price is determined by ebay based upon the
> sellers reserve and the bids made. Are you saying that you think ebay
> made a mistake in determining the final price?
>
Yes, I am.

Checking back the e-mails, it went like this:

I entered the bidding at £8 and reserve was met.
Second bidder outbid me at £51.
Second bidder withdrew. I was top bidder at £50.
Third bidder outbid me at £51.
Third bidder withdrew.
I am informed that I am top bidder at £50.

I believe I should be top bidder at £8, unless and until (an)other
bidder(s) join in.

"Mrs Nemo" <mrsnemo@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:d0cc035e.0307261119.257cec09@posting.google.c om...
> > You have to pay what is mentioned as the final price in the auction
> > description. That final price is determined by ebay based upon the
> > sellers reserve and the bids made. Are you saying that you think ebay
> > made a mistake in determining the final price?
> >
> Yes, I am.
>
> Checking back the e-mails, it went like this:
>
> I entered the bidding at £8 and reserve was met.
> Second bidder outbid me at £51.
> Second bidder withdrew. I was top bidder at £50.
> Third bidder outbid me at £51.
> Third bidder withdrew.
> I am informed that I am top bidder at £50.
>
> I believe I should be top bidder at £8, unless and until (an)other
> bidder(s) join in.

It would be helpful if you gave the auction number or provided a link to it
so we could see the bid history.

--
Best Regards
Niel Humphreys
Snowdon Computers

"Mrs Nemo" <mrsnemo@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:d0cc035e.0307261119.257cec09@posting.google.c om...
> > You have to pay what is mentioned as the final price in the auction
> > description. That final price is determined by ebay based upon the
> > sellers reserve and the bids made. Are you saying that you think ebay
> > made a mistake in determining the final price?
> >
> Yes, I am.
>
> Checking back the e-mails, it went like this:
>
> I entered the bidding at £8 and reserve was met.
> Second bidder outbid me at £51.
> Second bidder withdrew. I was top bidder at £50.
> Third bidder outbid me at £51.
> Third bidder withdrew.
> I am informed that I am top bidder at £50.
>
> I believe I should be top bidder at £8, unless and until (an)other
> bidder(s) join in.

I think you've been done. It was the action of the other bidders that pushed
it to that level, and they were obviously spoofing, for whatever reason. I'd
call this a hole in Ebay's logic.

Ali

In article <bful8g$iqiig$1@ID-97728.news.uni-berlin.de>,
Ali Hopkins says...
>
> "Mrs Nemo" <mrsnemo@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:d0cc035e.0307261119.257cec09@posting.google.c om...
> > > You have to pay what is mentioned as the final price in the auction
> > > description. That final price is determined by ebay based upon the
> > > sellers reserve and the bids made. Are you saying that you think ebay
> > > made a mistake in determining the final price?
> > >
> > Yes, I am.
> >
> > Checking back the e-mails, it went like this:
> >
> > I entered the bidding at £8 and reserve was met.
> > Second bidder outbid me at £51.
> > Second bidder withdrew. I was top bidder at £50.
> > Third bidder outbid me at £51.
> > Third bidder withdrew.
> > I am informed that I am top bidder at £50.
> >
> > I believe I should be top bidder at £8, unless and until (an)other
> > bidder(s) join in.
>
> I think you've been done. It was the action of the other bidders that pushed
> it to that level, and they were obviously spoofing, for whatever reason. I'd
> call this a hole in Ebay's logic.
>
> Ali
It certainly reads like a variation on shill bidding to
me.. But then, what do I know ?
>
>
>
T.
--
There are 10 types of people in the world.
Those that understand binary and those that don't.

Mrs Nemo wrote:
> If you will, picture this scenario.
>
> An item is put up on eBay with an opening price of £1 and a hidden
> reserve price. I put in a proxy bid of £50 maximum.
>
> Two other bidders join the auction and I am outbid when the top bid
> reaches £55.
>
> Both the 2 other bidders retract their bids and I am informed that I
> am the top bidder at £50 and that the reserve price has been met.
>
> IF the reserve price was set at £50, the above is all in order.
> However, let us suppose the reserve price was only £25. Or what if
> there had been no reserve price set.
>
> Surely the retraction of the two other bidders' bids should invalidate
> my bids over and above the opening bid or reserve price, unless and
> until a third bidder enters the market. In other words, failing
> further bidders, I should be top bidder at £25 (reserve price) or £1
> (opening bid.)
>
> I am in correspondence with eBay regarding this and have yet to have
> their final reply. I should be interested to hear what others think.

the reserve was obviously £50